Mr. Matharau to Mr. Ojinga: Kibaki is still your daddy
So, I’m reading this piece in the Nation where Mr. Matharau Muthaura is essentially telling Mr. Ojinga Odinga that his Executive Prime Ministerial position is basically useless. According to Muthaura: “The PM will come in handy in setting up inter-ministerial committees, following up on policy, sometimes developing the policy and ensuring ministries are kept in focus….He said that in line with the accord, Mr Odinga will recommend the MPs to be appointed to the Cabinet and the President will decide“.(Full Article here: While you were sleeping).
What’s that proverb? how many ways are there to skin a cat? I want to change this proverb up a bit by asking the following question: How many ways are there to screw Raila Odinga? From the front? How about from the back? Sideways? missionary? how do you like it? (don’t answer that. It’s a rhetorical question). Who is it that said the following? politics is almost as exciting as war and quite as dangerous. In war, you can only be killed once, but in politics, many times.”
Moving on to my second point on this issue.
As I’ve been going through the written version of the deal that was signed last week, it struck me as being way too general and if this was done on purpose, I’d have to chalk it up to the brilliant lawyering skills of Mutula Kilonzo and Martha Karua. Anyone who’s taken a legislative law class or any other class where you are asked to construct a legal statute, will tell you that the most important thing you must do is ensure that the language within that statute is extremely specific and very clear. Why? Because the more specific it is, the more difficult it will be to challenge. On the other side of the equation, if you make it very general, then you allow people to come up with all sorts of interpretations and challenges because generalities lead to a lack of clarity and whenever you have a lack of clarity, you inevitably end up with a legal challenge. This is where Kilonzo and Karua may have outwitted Orengo. This deal is so general in it’s outlook, that it will give them all sorts of room to interpret and challenge it from all sides (& if you read the article above, Kilonzo is already beginning to do this).
Why did ODM let non-lawyers like Ruto and Mudavadi go up against seasoned lawyers like Karua and Kilonzo? Poor Orengo. He was outgunned, but he should have followed the basic rule of legal construction: Don’t give your opponent any room to maneuver and the only way to do that is to make sure that every single word, every single full stop and every single comma is exactly where you want it to be.
KE- Am not doubting you But I think Parliament will legislate the deal plus all the Laws in it.
So Muthaura’s statement could turn up to be just an opinion.Remember ODM has a strong parliament presence.Parliament makes laws NOT Muthaura or an outnumbered govt. in a democracy.
There’s a need to pursue peaceful means at all costs. Kenya is ours and majority love coexisting together. I don’t think Muthaura is representing the wishes of the government. He could be testing the waters but we need to move on with reconciliation and healing. No need to antagonize anyone.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v.....re=related
let muthaura and the odm mouths talk, we recently figured that they are not the level at which decisions are taken.
KE
talking of Parliament, head to /bdafrica.com/ and see what the former MPs gave themselves as “pension”. some of the really hardworking former members will be taking home 400,000 ($6000) every month FOR THE REST OF THEIR LIVES. Oh dear…here we go again
You’re such a hate-monger. It’s people like you who should be prosecuted for incitement. You don’t seem to realize how sensitive the whole thing is. You seem to have the brain of a two year old and that’s really sad…
Ann-Marie:
When you leave such basic, simple comments like the one above, it simply tells me that you are incapable of providing a counter-argument. I want you to try again, but this time please raise the level of your critique.
Nothing wrong with what Anne marie has stated. You and others seem to forget that this peace accord was brought about to diffuse simmering tensions and mistrusts within Kenyans. Forget the politicians, they know each other and they will NOT hack each other with pangas. Though Kenyans, and particularly those living on others “perceived” lands are not so lucky.
Such reckless statements by Muthafuckaura will start the usual tensions, anger, and retaliation witnessed after the ridiculous swearing in ceremony.
This deal is supposed to start a new Kenya whereby we work together to share power and devolve imperial powers held by the president. We can already see that the Kikuyu Mafia Oligarchy is trying to bring about malicious and ill wishes to the Annan accord. KE even you are not probably a member of the oligarchy like many kyuks, why you seek to help them selfishly protect their ill gotten wealth on behalf of the WHOLE of Kenya baffles me and other Kenyans. the difference is that while the likes of you only look to compete against Luos and other marginalized tribes in Kenya. Others seeking a better constitution and want to compete globally against nations with better systems and means of governance.
Queen Kibaki and his court jesters are at it again. If they keep this up then the solution will be putting a a gun to their heads. Mark my words, the failure of this govt. has been to read the mood of Kenyans, and recently the international community, including the Great Lakes region. They (intl. comm) dont give a flying fuck about Kikuyus, Luos, Kambas etc.. What they need is a stable Kenya and prosperous one at that. Stable means that everybody is comfortable and has equal access to resources, security, land, and interaction with other communities. It is clear that we are starting to see the kicks of a dying govt. horse. Lets wait and see what is being said in Parliament. Laws will not be passed in bus parks (Karua), nor will they be passed by Muthafukaura and his boy lover Alfred Mutua. Again the banana republic government has yet again put its foot in its mouth.
Surely, why does this governmenrt always need baby sitters to handle their business aka US, EU, AU, UK. Wacha waendelee na upumbavu. You are what you say, Mavi ya Kuku.
KE, one can only expect that you of all people would think this is a brilliant ploy by the PNU team, but what you fail to recognize is that people are seeing right through this bullshit. And I am talking about people like me who are on neither side of the ODM/PNU divide, but who care more about the nation as a whole. These are the kinds of stunts that make civil strife and acrimony amongst people blossom because they believe that negotiations will be compromised by these last minute changes of heart. This makes for a very angry and disenfranchised population who believe that the only way to solve problems is through violence and killing of people who believe anything different than them. This is not what you want Kenya to turn into and you might think you are really smart for noting that PNU and Karua/Kilonzo outmanouevered Orengo (be as it may the case), but the larger point is it is not about these individuals. Nor is it really about Kibaki and Odinga, quite frankly. Its about the message that this whole exercise is going to send out for the future of Kenya as a nation.
Its nice to see folks are done with all the tribal b.s. I initially withheld commenting from this blog entry because I realized not too long ago that KE, your ilk of Kenyan is what is wrong with our country. The “us” vs. “them” mentality you continue to foment is counterproductive. You argue for reasoned discourse from Anne-Marie yet calling Hon. Raila “Ojinga” clearly gives away your preconceived bias that would leave you unable to listen to any reasoned argument that would put ODM/Raila in any positive light. I watched carefully when the peace deal was struck and noted how muted your commentary was. Are you so bent on PNU/Kibaki coming out on top rather than seeing peace and unity prevail? The entrepreneurship you pretend to champion is naught without the everyday kenyan living in peace and harmony…don’t forget that. The demon of tribalism that seems so deeply rooted in your consciousness will forever doom your thinking to be void of anything productive that will build Kenya as a country.
Ok, that’s my rant. As for the “whose your daddy” comment…time will tell. What we all know to be true:
1) Kenyans are done with b.s from leaders who seem to be only interested in fattening their pockets at the expense of the general public.
2) No one (or two or three) community/tribe(s) will hold all others at ransom.
3) This thing is bigger than any individual. Raila may be duped, but Kenyans won’t! As soon as anybody wishing to pull a fast one in the current deal realizes this, the sooner things can begin returning to relative normalcy. If not, we may be in store for more ugly scenes.
Am sure the snakes are just waiting until this arrangement is legal, then they’ll continue unleashing their stoneage approaches to ‘equitable distribution’.
@Matofa, we are marking your words. What you seem to forget is that this arrangement came about as a result of violence. Don’t expect great things from it, because this arrangement legitimized the use murder, genocide, chaos to bully people into getting what you want. Live by the sword…. Make a point of marking those words.
whats the deal with this muthaura guy anywayz. who cares what he thinks, probably just lesotho citizens. the rest of kenyans are ready for peace. if mt kenya mafia wants war kenyan’s are ready, the second wave will not be from kale’s, luo’s or luhya’s but from maasai’s samburu’s, turkana’s mijikenda’s, somali’s, even kamba’s might join the second liberation…
I agree completely with Don.I too noted your reaction when the peace deal was struck. It bollocked your theory of the government strong arming its way out of the election crisis. It is the Kenyan people/international community who have outsmarted this govt. It amazes me how slow they have been to read the writing on the wall.Mutharua just purchased a one way ticket to political oblivion.Kazi ieendelee
Kiumane
Kwani you think that war is a picnic. Where did you get that war talk???
Let me tell you one thing, if you are harbouring genocidal intentions against any Kikuyus or Lesotho people as you called them, you will be surprised that they are very capable of defending themselves. I think Nakuru, Eldoret, Molo and Naivasha are good examples. Not that this anything to be celebrated.
Muthaura’s comments are valid and what should happen is that there should be a vibrant debate on the comments without peope running for their bows and arrows. Thats a bit primitive and defeatist.
Mr Kiumane, let me remind you that the clashes started as Kikuyu V Kalenjin, then became Kalenjin V Kisii, then Maasai V Kalenjin, then Kalenjin V Luhyia, then Pokot V Marakwet, then Turkana V Pokot, then Samburu V Turkana, then Kikuyu V Samburu, then Miji Kenda V Everybody etc etc etc.
So wacha domo domo and pray for the peace to hold. Do not cheat yourself that only Kikuyus will suffer in such a scenario. Everybody will suffer.
Kikuyus are not your whipping boys. They will always defend themselves.
It’s funny. After this so called peace deal was signed, all the preach peace people were here shouting about how wrong I was, but as I look back at my prediction, I recall saying that as soon as Koffi Annan jetted out of the country, the peace deal was going to get trashed and it appears to be happening.
I continue to be amazed at the inability of adults to accept and comprehend the very basic dynamic that defines all politics and that dynamic is power. I said before that the clue to understanding this crisis lies in one’s ability to comprehend the psychology of the main actors in power.
Kibaki and his closest advisers are ideologues. They believe in their hearts that they are the only one’s who can fix Kenya’s problems after 24 years of inept rule from Moi. They are not doing it for money because these men are already rich and they are not doing it for ego because they are too old to give a damn about their individual ego’s. They are going to stay in power and rule the country by force because they believe that their way is the right way.
The second dynamic to understand is the impact the violence had on their already hardened psyche’s. They simply cannot allow William Ruto and Raila odinga anywhere near the most sensitive corridors of power because they are convinced that these two men are out to “finish” Kikuyu’s. The largest ethnic group in the country, that is now in power, has been backed into a corner and they have no choice, but to hold on to that power for their own basic survival.
When you have people like Najib Balala threatening to turn central province into an island like lesotho…what kind of reaction do you expect from the people in power? capitulation? I don’t think so.
KIUMANE and the REST of Primitive creatures……Why do you always hold an individual’s action (Muthaura) to condemn the whole group (Kyuks).Was Muthaura’s statement drafted by Kyuks as a whole. This nonesense has to end. Its a pity that ONLY in Kenya and some parts of Africa where a whole group is dragged into one’s action. Look at the Elections. Kyuks voted but were they all at the counting halls?Did those innocent women and children at the Eldoret church conspire with Kivuitu to “rig” elections?Thats what we call PRIMITIVE action. Leaders will steal from public funds,”eat” with families and a few friends and then when they get accused, the PRIMITIVES claim one of their own is being victimised and so they all threaten war,yet they NEVER shared the loot.Pure stupidity.GOD help them.
@josh
i have to agree with what u say above, if kenya ever splits all tribes will eventually be fighting against each other for resources. on muthaura’s statements i personally think he spoke too soon, what he said might actually be true, but whats the point of getting kenyans rilled up when things are actually calming down..
PROUDKALEO,
I actually agree with you…..(for the first time) on muthaura’s statements.
But on the “all tribes will be at war for resources” I’m forced to ask myself over and over again: what resources ? We do not have crude oil or diamonds or large quantities of gold that people can fight over. I think the “resources” you are saying is basically POWER.
Power to appoint ministers, parastatal heads, etc.If an MP’s sole role was to rep his constituents,not to manage ministries, I think there’d be less of an incentive to be an MP so as to be a minister.
Moi used the parastatals bodies as a power play. he’d appoint and fire his political friends and enemies and the sad is that these parastatals controlled very substantial stakes of our small economy.
The more I look at kenya the more it resembles animal farm. The elites rule over the massess.the masses keep voting back the same elites who don’t give a damn about them. when a real reformer is voted in, he’s either tarnished thru slander or lies or even killed or basically discredited.
@MZEIYA- Best point so far. To add to your point, the problem we have today is based upon lack of true patriotic leaders. Look at all main Leaders today.From Kibaki, Raila,Kalonzo, Ruto…..at one point they all looked the other way when Kenya was being “Raped” by regimes. Then all of a sudden they “Reformed” and we entrusted them with leadership. Raila……don’t even go there….we all know his merge with Kanu and Molasses deals.So I have a Question for you MZEIYA….whom would you call a real Kenyan Patriot leader today….someone less tainted. Orengo???
KE,
I have to agree with Don on this one, your loss of perspective is starting to hinge on irrationality. You accuse people of lack of pragmatism and realism yet you my friend seem to exhibit the worst case of this. I’ll directly respond to the refrain you keep repeating ad nauseum “Michuki and Kibaki who are the ultimate power weilders will not acquiesce or accomodate the villian that is Raila and the power he represents” yet this assertion has fallen flat repeatedly over the past few months:
For starters it has become quite apparent to Kikuyus that Kibaki cannot protect them from tribal retribution, this fact was also not lost on the AMERICANS who understood that Kibaki does not weild control of the country….neither politically nor militarily………it came down to an issue of stability hence the reason why Kibaki acquiesced in the end. The threat of external military intervention had the cat finally catch the canary. As you yourself clearly understand, the Americans are the ultimate pragmatists and realists
Second, the political alliance that Raila represents are emboldened by the recent turn of events. Do you honestly believe that Ruto is scared? The greatest irony of all is that Ruto received the same punitive treatment by the Americans and Europeans as most of Kibaki’s cabinet so his sins as seen by those who hold the purse strings as equal or less than those of the Kibaki hardliners. My question to you is, WHO WILL PUNISH RUTO?
Kibaki does not weild the military force to do so and neither is the international community pulling the strings behind the scenes to facilitate this so who will do it?
Third, don’t you find it curious that only NOW does the Kenyan military have the balls to crack down on insurgent activity in the country? Why is that yet during the height of ethnic cleansing they were nowhere to be seen?
Which brings me to the conclusion that Kibaki’s underbelly is softer than Raila’s as made patently clear by the final turn of events. Kibaki gained zero ground since the country went up in flames, even if Raila remains the third in command, the fact of the matter is Kibaki controls the same 50% of government machinery now that he started with coupled with the entrenchment of a competing center of power in the country. This for a leader who was already weak to begin with and now increasingly isolated.
http://www.thetidenews.com/art.....mn=FOREIGN
trust the AMERICANS to remind EVERYBODY who the real daddy is
DEE,
I Think at times (and sadly), a true patriot is discovered by history. what do I mean ? I think that once time goes by and we look back- looking back from a rear view mirror- is when we might really see who was a genuine kenyan patriot and who was not.
about ORENGO: He defeinitely deserves some credit as “freedom” fighter in the 90′s for standing up to the tyrannical Moi regime and holding his ground. I recall he once tried to propose a vote of no confidence against Moi, but it didn’t go thru. Is he a reformer ? patriot ? true leader ?
I know we can say he fought for the common man-the only thing with kenyan politics is that it has a way to turn the best amonst us into beasts.
The only way I’d judge Orengo is if he became the president, and I’d like to see if he’d change once he tasted that power.
Alot of “reformer” politicians have let us down. Look at Anyan Nyong, this guy is a brainiac, very respected, but his performance during this whole episode left alot to be desired from him. He seems to have become a demagogue….
Dee, I honestly think there’s something so sweet about having power in kenya that it just changes you. I think the independence government inherited the structures from their masters the british. Those Structures were intended to solidify and stranglehold, and maintain the dominance of the british over the africans.
This dominance is what Mau mau and the rest were fighting against. However, once the africans got their independence and took charge, they must have found the seat of power to be very comfortable and very effective. The new african leaders just replaced their wazungu counterparts, but left the structure intact.The same way the mzungu oppressed the african is the same exact way the african used to oppress and keep a solid hold of his fellow “lower” africans.
This has continued upto today and that’s why we still have a constitution that does not work for a new kenya. That’s why we still have a constitution that gives a president too much power-which should be drastcially reduced.
we do not know who will be kenya’s next president but we know it will be someone we already familiar with.The next president will come from the current generation of MP’s we have today. We may get a new prezzi in 2012 and look back and wish for the kibaki years where democratic spaces were expanded. or we may get someone and wonder why we didn’t vote for them earlier- yaani a person doing a better job than kibaki.
Our current leaders use the same exact tactics to keep them in power and keep us divided, that the wazungu used.Divide and rule…..and shame on our leaders for doing that, but at the same time shame on us for allowing them to do that!!
Kibaki tried to introduce a new constitution in 2005 but two things were against him: He underestimated the need to vigorusly campaign and sell your ideas to the masses-unlike Raila and Co who vigrously campaigned against it on atribal platfrom (divide and rule) by convincing kenyan that the wako draft was meant to perpetuate kikuyu power milele.
But Dee to answer your question , I’ll have to answer it in context to australia. They recently got a new PM, a guy called Rudd. I don’t know too much about him but his actions have said alot within his short term in power. He formally apologized to the aborigine community-which had never been done and he also said that aussie troops would immediately pull out from iraq, as there was no benefit in them staying there. He basically reversed all the negative things his predecesor had done.
In this new group of kenya’s politicans, who has the potential to take kenya to the next level after kibaki ? It’s an open question but there’s one definite answer- it can never be ruto because all warlords are the same.Just like Isaias Afwerki fought a guerilla warfare agaisnt ethipiato liberate eritrea, when he became president, he used the same warlord/dictatorial antics on his people.
SIJUI,
Ati RUTO is not scared ? why do you think he entrenched himself in the frist negotiation/mediation team yet he was not a lawyer ?
Why do you think he accompanied Raila to see kibaki during their first ever private meeting ? yet he was frozen, kibaki said he only wanted to talk to Raila…
Among all the ODM MP’s,why is he the only one telling his fellow kale MP’s to lobby for him in public about him being appointed DPM.
Why in the world does he want the DPM Post so badly ? Could it be he’s trying as much as possible to remain relevant and avoid prosecution ?
You did bring out a point though, about the Millitary not quelling the violence in the heat of it but are busy doing so now.
Could it be that maybe the gava was planning for the grand retaliation to deal with this militia problems once and for all ? and we all know that these types of retributions require planning that may take time, not just hurrying to do things without a plan.
why is Nakitari on the run hiding ? if he has nothing hide, then why the hell is he hiding like a dog with it’s tail in between it’s legs?
why was there total re-alignment of the security forces in kenya ?
Ruto knows that people know what he did…he’s already a villain. Raila now has the hard job of determining who will get the single DPM Post..will it be mudavadi or ruto ? If Raila chooses Ruto, then all the goodwill is gone from kyuks and I’m sure if that happens, Ruto may have the largest security detail to date.
and lastly, why is the gava transferring 1000 policemen to serve in areas the’re not familiar with in the name of “de-ethnicising” the force? what the hell is “de-ethnicizing” ?
Mzeiya,
Good observation up there. For pointing out to proud kalle that its not resources these guys fight for, it’s the POWER to grab as much as they can.
I remember at some point nyayo was so redundant, he had ministries of agric, of arid and semi-arid areas, of livestock and of horticulture??
The ministerial duties overlapped: And I think thats how leadership was destroyed in Kenya.
I think its the same problem raila has, trying to create posts of power ,in the name of resources.
Why does he need two deputys . Three grown men ( and fully staffed offices chauffers )doing same old duties . Nyayo defined resources as power, these guys were there and have not reformed alot. But can you teach old dogs new tricks. They have alot of “unlearning” to do. We need a new generation up there.
Mzeiya, please which goodwill remains for the Kalenjins among the Kikuyu? As you yourself stated, everyone knows that Ruto was instrumental in whatever violence that was meted out so there is zero he can do to redeem himself with that community and I have a hunch that he is not even trying…….
Ruto has always been a lawyer by training so clearly you are misinformed on this issue. Everyone knows this.
Thirdly, Ruto was instrumental on the ODM side precisely because he weilds control of a powerful political constituency and it will remain so for the foreseable future. He is lobbying the Rift Valley to counter claims to the post by perhaps Charity or Balala who are also instrumental in the Pentagon. It is the same old politics, who delivered the real goods to the table in the current scenario Raila? Was it the Rift Valley caucus, Charity’s Kamba alliance or the Coast Caucus? We all assume that Mudavadi must get one of the posts for his contribution so the three must battle it out…….and I agree with you on this point, Raila will have a tough decision to make here bearing in full Ruto’s unsavory nature.
Which brings me to my final point, I doubt highly Ruto will face any prosecution. The greatest irony being he faced the greatest threat to ascendancy in the first Kibaki term when he was mired in corruption cases yet he escaped the noose because I presume HE KNEW WHERE TOO MANY SKELETONS WERE HIDDEN. Now with claim to a powerful political constituency (isn’t is amazing how he wrestled control from the combination of the powerful MOI-BIWOTT machine and the track record/competence of the heir apparant Kipruto Kirwa) he is indispensable to ODM’s fortunes and they know it.
Just being ‘real’ and ‘pragmatic’………
Sijui:
Ruto is not a lawyer (where did you get than info from?) he went to the university of Nairobi and majored in Botany.
Also, your contention that America threatened to launch military action against Kenya is simply ridiculous.
*America is mired in the middle of two wars (Afghanistan and Iraq) and one war (iraq) is very unpopular.
*Bush is getting ready to leave office in less than one year, his approval ratings have gone to the dogs (they’re in the low 30′s) and a presidential election is looming.
*There is no way in hell that Bush would risk young American lives in a third world backwater country like Kenya. If he didn’t do it in Darfur where 200,000 have lost their lives, he was not going to do it in kenya where only 1,000 had been killed. And please remember, that Kibaki has helped America in it’s war on terror and it would be foolish for them to bring down such an ally.
And no, I am not surprised it has taken the army this long to respond. As I’ve said on numerous occassions, they had to plan their retaliation and Kibaki still needs time to “clean” out many people within the army ranks. This process of retaliation is going to take a good 2 maybe even 3 years and you will start to see it play out.
Whether Ruto is scared or not is irrelevant and has no bearing on what will ultimately come his way.
SIJUI,
I do not know of ruto being a lawyer by training. His profile says he got a degree in Botany from one of the universities in kenya.
It’s true, Ruto delivered more for ODM than any pentagon member,I mean ODM tripled PNU in rift valley, and he proved that Moi & Co were irrelevant in Rift Valley.
He still has court cases, and he’s been able to extend (not avoid) them thru legal technicalities-that’s why we need a new constitution.
But I really want to see how Raila will handle this one, i.e. who to appoint for DPM..I Think in the public psyche, anyone but Ruto is acceptable, but what will raila do ?
Raila is faed with two options, one of making his future relevant by choosing Mudavadi and saying he acted as they had agreed. In that case, Ruto will slowly become irrelevant, and bu doing this Raila might win enemies to friends. If he chooses ruto, the he will protrah himself as someone who doesnt care what the publuc feels and it might cost him politically in the future, in case Ruto vies for presidency. Its a way of affirming thatRuto is so powerful that whatever he does doesnt matter, he gets his way. I dont want to act prophet, but what goes on in Railas mind is always a mystery. Im sure he is waiting for the legitimate power to do what he thinks best. At the same time, he might decide to give it to ruto to protect him and his croonies from what appears to have stared. Mudavadi doesnt need protection anyway. If he chooses Mudavadi, just know the race to state house 2012 has just began! And since he is known to eliminate compe before youre even aware of it, thats why even ODM members are scared of what raila may do. He has the upper hand for now!
KE please read my posting again about America and external military intervention. Did I SAY THEY WOULD LAUNCH A MILITARY INTERVENTION or did I say the threat of military intervention?
You obviously did not follow at all the conversations that went on between George Bush, Condi, the AU head Jakaya Kikwete and Koffi Annan and NO! the details were not spelt out on CNN, KTV and KBC. For someone who claims to know realpolitik you obviously missed the boat on this one! If you’d like to reasearch this on your own I’d suggest you google the Council on Foreign Relations and other security sites and check their briefs and updates on the Kenya situation vis a vis the U.S. position………or more simply what would compel Kibaki to capitulate? In addition to frozen assets and deportation of relatives, what else? America does not need nor care to use U.S. forces, however there are obviously surrogates for American military objectives in East Africa and in this case it has less to do with U.S. objectives and more security interests hence the reason why the AU was laying the ground to send troops backed by the U.N., E.U. and bankrolled by the U.S.
Or do you believe that Kikwete convinced Kibaki that the TZ model was viable? Especially from a man adamant about absolute power…..enough said. As for ‘cleaning’ the army, what wishful thinking……when the state could not even protect ministers leave alone the general public from armed thuggery. They obviously lack the acumen of Moi in these things plus the manpower to accomplish this but yes maybe they will succeed in Kikuyunizing the military……
And I concede that my facts were wrong about Ruto, he is not a lawyer by training.
SIJUI,
You mentioned something about Kikwete of TZ…are u minimalizing his role in the whole peace deal thing ?
Sijui:
The council on foreign relations and other think tanks are filled with ex-government bureacrats who are waiting it out until the “right” administration comes into office so that they can get their government jobs back. Right now, those think tanks are filled with a bunch of ex democrats because Bush is in power, but if Hillary or Obama wins, they’ll be right there angling for positions and using those useless policy papers as proof of their knowledge of the world.
As I’m sure you know, the neo-conservatives who advocated this disastrous war in Iraq, spent years hanging out as these kinds of think tanks (the heritage foundation and yes, even the council on foreign relations). I would not put too much weight on policy papers from the think tanks.
You are right. You said condi may have used the “threat” of military intervention. I don’t think she did, but I wasn’t there so I won’t argue this point. However, even if she did, who would believe her at this point? Again, look at Darfur, a much worse situation than Kenya’s and nothing has happened there despite all the threats.
And you are right again in saying that there was a security failure and Kibaki was not as paranoid about security as moi. However, remember that moi was almost overthrown and that’s when he became paranoid about security. This violence is going to become Kibaki’s “1982″ and he is now going to focus on security, I believe.
@ke and co
what is the beef between kyuks and luo’s????. why so much hate towards RAILA??? Looks like all kenyans are in love with this guy because he is willing to talk about issues that no other politician is willing to deal with.. just curios..
proudkaleo:
I’d say there is more anger towards the kalenjins than luo’s. Don’t you think?
Sijui,
I think you really missed the point, Why would they send UN/EU/US troops to do in kenya? ….to kill kales or mungiki?
Freezing the assets , visas and kikwete would be a better choice.
@ sijui: God and The Universe are currently tag-teaming to punish Ruto. He can’t go nowhere bila security detail and doesn’t even sleep in his own home. A cloak and dagger existence is all very nice in the movies, but it will take its toll. You watch and see.
Also, your emphatic statement “Ruto has always been a lawyer by training so clearly you are misinformed on this issue. Everyone knows this.” is completely emblematic of ODM’s misinformation campaigns. You were virtually, with the strike of a few keys on your keyboard, giving Ruto training that he does not (evidently) possess. It is very big of you to conceed that “my facts were wrong about Ruto, he is not a lawyer by training”, but after all that misinformation, why should we believe anything else out your keyboard?!
@proudkaleo. Enough with this “all kenyans” nonsense. Can you please start putting numbers, and not airy-fairy words on the table? Those who are pro-Kibaki are not kenyans? Define what you mean by “all kenyans”.
psydof:
what do you mean God and the Universe are tagging Ruto?
What? you think he’ll be struck down by a strange bolt of lighining flying down from the clouds? 
KE
OK, so I got a little carried away. I meant that when you live by the sword, don’t be surprised if you’re cut down by one. I meant that even though he is alive, he is not relaxed, and that will take its toll with time.