There is also the issue of class especially Europe.

A poor working class client vs a poor aristocrat (the aristocrat has the upper hand)
A rich working class client vs a rich upper class client (the upper class client has the upper hand)

My point is that the issue of justice is not as clear cut as some would have us believe. There are always other variables involved.

CT

That is precisely my point.

Kei O: By the way, you can purchase “justice” in the EU. The rich people always get the BEST lawyers.

Well, the rich get the best of everything. That’s why everyone wants to be rich!

However, in court cases, the disparity in wealth is most pronounced when you have the following scenario’s:

A poor client vs. a very rich client (here, the one with money will win).

A rich client vs. another rich client (here, it will be more equal).

A poor client vs. another poor client (again, here, it will be more equal).

When you say that one can purchase justice in Europe, maybe you need to make a distinction between civil cases and criminal cases. I think that even with money, if you commit a criminal offense, it will much tougher to just get off scotch free.

In Kenya, even if you murdered someone, you could get off if you had enough money to bribe. Look at cholomdeley. Do you think he’d get away with that in England?

Kei O: It is not the case, my friend.By the way, you can purchase “justice” in the EU.The rich people always get the BEST lawyers.Furthermore, sensitive cases can also be terminated by the Attorney General.A recent case in the UK is the Saudi Arms deal, where a UK company was involved in corruption with some powerful Arabs.The Arabs tthreatened to spill the beans unless the case was terminated and guess what happened – the UK Attorney General terminated the case.

A UK firm bribed to get the deal. The benefit accrued to the UK i.e. jobs to UK, etc… Corruption is wrong but the UK’s government figured the UK benefits!

In Kenya, the Kenyan bastards (MPs, ministers, etc) sell us out to the Chinese, Libyans, Indians, etc… so we lose Kenyan jobs to the others… there are NO benefits that accrue to ordinary Kenyans!

Unemploment benefit does NOT equal giving hand outs.

You seem to have a lot of misconceptions about many things.

You have a good sense of humour – rubber stamps, inkpads and foolscaps! Heheheheheee.. I can’t even remember the last time I saw a foolscap to be honest.

We use databases, wordprocessors, spreadsheets etc. I cannot say I am the very best in what I do, but I can tell you that I very good at what I do. I am sure that you can already tell that.

Now, back to the discussion.

I dont get it when you say that the West does not prey on its own. Let me tell you something my friend, EU and USA are full of poor people. Ofcourse, poverty is relative but it is true that it is only a minority that are rich in these countries.

I can certainly tell you that there are some very poor people in the UK who just rely on state handouts and charities.

A thinker once told me that the only reason that EU countries provide state handouts is to prevent RIOTING. And I believed him, when I examined the situation closely. There would certainly be RIOTS in the UK if there were no state benefits for the poor. Mind you the state benefits are designed to keep you JUST satisfied – basically keep you alive.

You seem to be under the misconception that ALL IS WELL in EU and USA. It is not the case, my friend.

By the way, you can purchase “justice” in the EU. The rich people always get the BEST lawyers. Furthermore, sensitive cases can also be terminated by the Attorney General.

A recent case in the UK is the Saudi Arms deal, where a UK company was involved in corruption with some powerful Arabs. The Arabs tthreatened to spill the beans unless the case was terminated and guess what happened – the UK Attorney General terminated the case.

We know better, my friend. This is why I always tell you to leave Kenya, even its just for 5 years. You will learn alot.

Kenyan courts are a bloody nightmare!

And as regards the argument that India (or China) can produce billionaires coz it has 1 billion+ people while Kenya can’t coz it has 35 million… that is silly coz the richest Indian (Mittal) made most – if not all – of his money OUTSIDE of India… Well, the UK, Germany, Australia, etc has many, many millionaires… (Australia’s population is smaller than Kenya’s)

And using that stupid argument… Hong Kong (among other countries/areas) should have no billionaires. And Singapore is an example… no/few resources but HARD WORK & “CLEANLINESS”.

KeiO: Stop bandying about your ignorance… West Africa is full of Lebanese business groups! If not for the endless coups in West African countries, the presence would be greater. Furthermore, I have seen Tata (Indian) trucks all over W.Africa esp Ghana. And many of the ‘Nigerian’ businesses have Indian managers. And these are black Nigerian owned businesses… (BTW, if any country is more corrupt than Kenya = Nigeria)

And the main reason for Indians in East Africa was ‘transport’ as in… the ease of sailing over to the East coast of Africa as well as Arabs using Mhindis as accountants & moneylenders. And the Brits importing labour.

Short Change: Ke,Since you seem to be leading the reading bandwagon.What are the best three books in “decolonizing the mind”have you read ?Answer this question and do not give some required textbook for a class you took at college or university.Ps. And No New Age Movement stuff.

I don’t read New age movement stuff and I’m not quite sure what you mean by books on “decolonizing the mind”.

My basic point was that people have a right to read whatever it is that interests them and reading is always better than non-reading.

I realise it might be hard for you to see the contradiction in your denial of presesence of Justice in Western world viz a viz Kenya…Introducing kenyas scenarios which are parallel with your world view will only SPIN you further.
So forget my previous examples that were meant to cajole your mind

Let me try this

Let us accept as a fact your perception of Western culture. ie

it is

1) Thieving ,predatory culture that somehow does NOT bite (prey on ) itself

We can paraprhrase much more accurately as an IMPERIALISTIC culture

accepted……

So dont you think it qualifies as a culture?

You have admited (though not on words) that they rligiously follow this to the letter and through their legal system its jelously protected

KENYA

Lack of culture is wha is LACKING….
beacuse

1) one can purchase justice to achieve any outcome ? (no guiding cultural principles)

Its because of THIS that I and to some extent KE put CULTURE as a kardinal

requirement to produce an ENVIROMENT that will enable people dwell on making products profitably…..instead of CONVEYANCING

Conveyancing…is not an ilegal trade anywhere only it entail the least production of all hence least profitable(many people can do)

I would be glad if you were a top notch lawyer in the west( dispenser of justice) rather than just another guy with a briefcase ful of rubber stamps, ink pads and foolscaps (conveyor)

Thats beautiful….
let me see how to reply to you